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    Thread: How much would it cost to build a race track?

    1. Member mobile363's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 05:47 PM #1
      Lets say you have the required land. For example, 640 acres is a common parcel size for land sales in my area. This is one square mile which is likely more land than is required. Lets say you build a 2.5 mile circuit and want exceptional quality of tarmac surface. Excluding the price of land, how much is this going to cost? What about opening up such a venue to the public? I would imagine there would be monumental legal proceedings to go through before anyone would be allowed to use it? Is it even practical for a private organization to do something like this?

      It was always been a wild dream of mine.


    2. Member venom600's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 05:54 PM #2
      Sorry, I don't have anything to add about pricing, but consider that beyond the actual land, you have to consider the fact that the sound would make it VERY difficult to build. Idiots will move next to the track and then complain that the cars are too loud, and sound carries over long distances. I live 20 miles away from California Speedway and I can hear the racing whenever I go outside during the NASCAR weekend they have.


    3. Member 20AE3600's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 05:54 PM #3
      My father always told me that of I have to ask how much it cost that I couldn't afford it!
      I have nothing witty to add here

    4. 03-31-2008 05:55 PM #4
      Check out http://www.midamericamotorplex...t.asp

      I can't remember the exact cost, but it was about as cheap as they could make it.

      Another choice would be a rallycross track, no need for paving there!


    5. Member VDubby18's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 05:56 PM #5
      I dunno but theres a 2 mile track near me, private, 4000 a year to be a member. And I love seeing some of the cars that go into it, lots of exotics, porsches, Lotus... just crazy expensive cars.

      Or rally racing... just drive around with a truck over and over and get some dirt roads going

    6. Member Chmeeee's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 05:59 PM #6
      You definitely have to leave room for buffer zones and such to keep noise down on neighboring properties. That said, a new road course is going up around here on approximately the same amount of land:

      http://www.palmermotorsportspark.com/faq.htm

      Quote Originally Posted by Captain 'Murica! View Post
      What if my idea is to go faster around a track than your idea?

      Corvette. Less than you can afford, pal.

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    7. Member Tornado2dr's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 06:00 PM #7
      Quote, originally posted by mobile363 »
      It was always been a wild dream of mine.

      Land= Location dependant

      Construction= depends on venue, topography, amount of earth to be moved and land to be cleared...figure a few million (this is experience talking) Pavement alone would be around 1 million in this area.

      Buildings?

      Insurance: Have fun with being able to make the premium for this!

      A friend of mine built a nice little dirt go-kart track on his farm, it has a neat little turn that mimics LagunaSeca's corcscrew, but with more fear due to the trees.
      This is probably as close as you wanna come to your own racetrack, or if you have a really big plot of land, just make your driveway very long and twisty.


    8. Member Chmeeee's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 06:13 PM #8
      Also, a good ballpark for roadway construction costs (I would assume this would also apply to race tracks) is $100/lane foot.

      If you assume that the track is three lanes wide (40 feet) and 2.5 miles long, that gives you $4 million. Thats assuming no major grading obstacles. Add for parking lots, entry roadways, buildings, etc as desired.

      EDIT: That may have gone up however, as asphalt has shot up with the cost of oil. You would be looking at about 20,000 tons of pavement, which runs $110 a ton, or $2.2 million in just materials.



      Modified by Chmeeee at 6:16 PM 3-31-2008

      Quote Originally Posted by Captain 'Murica! View Post
      What if my idea is to go faster around a track than your idea?

      Corvette. Less than you can afford, pal.

      | The Red Line
      | 1999 BMW 328i | 2013 Chevy Volt |

    9. Member undpilot757's Avatar
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      03-31-2008 06:22 PM #9
      My friends and I have a wild dream of rebuilding an abandoned race track that's about 40 miles from Chicago someday. But, like said before, noise! There's a random neighborhood there already. So that plan is pretty much ****. We'd also all need to aquire a lot of money. Me being an airline pilot, my other friend being a journalist, and the others doing god knows what, this is probably not going to happen. haha
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      04-01-2008 02:13 AM #10
      The big fees will be in the environmental inspection, and getting the noise easements.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

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      04-01-2008 04:17 AM #11
      Quote, originally posted by VDubby18 »
      I dunno but theres a 2 mile track near me, private, 4000 a year to be a member. And I love seeing some of the cars that go into it, lots of exotics, porsches, Lotus... just crazy expensive cars.

      Or rally racing... just drive around with a truck over and over and get some dirt roads going

      $4k a year is ok - do you know more about the conditions?

      Cheers - mike


    12. Senior Member Jman5000's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 08:11 AM #12
      Also consider maintenance, having fire/rescue on hand for every event, the infrastructure to enhance revenue/profitability (parking, food, stands, restrooms), and the infrastructure to run it...like offices and the like. Then hire the staff...

      Think millions and years before you're drawing profitable events and in the black.


    13. Member 155VERT83's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 08:22 AM #13
      (Carl Sagan voice): Billions, and billions...
      Signature blank...

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      04-01-2008 08:36 AM #14
      About $150 million for Sakhir.

      Probably cheaper if you don't get Tilke to design it.

      平成16 年の MAZDA RX-8 230

    15. Member AutoEuphoria's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 08:37 AM #15
      Lots. Insurance would be a bitch, too.

    16. 04-01-2008 08:40 AM #16
      one billion dollars!

    17. 04-01-2008 09:00 AM #17
      Your materials would be a small percentage of the costs of building a race track. Inspections, permits, engineering.. a lot of time and a lot of money, and that is still without the actual building of the track. If you were to get any type of financial backing, it would have to be a money maker, and race tracks generally are NOT, especially interesting ones with some right-hand turns.

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      04-01-2008 09:05 AM #18
      Quote, originally posted by mobile363 »
      Lets say you have the required land. For example, 640 acres is a common parcel size for land sales in my area. This is one square mile which is likely more land than is required. Lets say you build a 2.5 mile circuit and want exceptional quality of tarmac surface. Excluding the price of land, how much is this going to cost? What about opening up such a venue to the public? I would imagine there would be monumental legal proceedings to go through before anyone would be allowed to use it? Is it even practical for a private organization to do something like this?

      It was always been a wild dream of mine.

      2.5 miles of track would probably cost about 1 to 2 million per mile for an exceptional quality road surface assuming little to no clearing and minimal grading. That's just for laying the road. Now include track design, infrastructure, zoning, legalities, advertising, etc and it gets really pricey.

      The track below is being planned here in Colorado, but is being presented to a nationwide audience. The mastermind has been at it for a couple years and construction has yet to start. Tilke is the track designer, and it's a BIG track.

      http://www.theringoftherockies.com/


    19. Member wunde's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 09:29 AM #19
      Quote, originally posted by Tornado2dr »

      ...or if you have a really big plot of land, just make your driveway very long and twisty.

      This is what I would say is the best option. Don't go into it building a track. Build a looonnngggg driveway that loops past your "house and garage" and then back out. They can't site you for speeding on your own property, and you could have lot's of friends over. But if anyone gets hurt, it's your bum.


    20. Member slicecom's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 09:56 AM #20
      Quote, originally posted by venom600 »
      Sorry, I don't have anything to add about pricing, but consider that beyond the actual land, you have to consider the fact that the sound would make it VERY difficult to build. Idiots will move next to the track and then complain that the cars are too loud, and sound carries over long distances. I live 20 miles away from California Speedway and I can hear the racing whenever I go outside during the NASCAR weekend they have.

      So true. This is happening to all the great tracks and it makes me want to go punch each and every one of these idiots in the face.


    21. Member slicecom's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 09:58 AM #21
      Quote, originally posted by HwAoRrDk »
      About $150 million for Sakhir.

      Probably cheaper if you don't get Tilke to design it.

      And considering a 2 year old could design a better track than Tilke by scribbling on a page, its probably best you find someone else to design it!


    22. Member The Road Warrior's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 10:07 AM #22
      Quote, originally posted by undpilot757 »
      My friends and I have a wild dream of rebuilding an abandoned race track that's about 40 miles from Chicago someday. But, like said before, noise! There's a random neighborhood there already. So that plan is pretty much ****. We'd also all need to aquire a lot of money. Me being an airline pilot, my other friend being a journalist, and the others doing god knows what, this is probably not going to happen. haha

      Which one? Race Way Woods?


    23. 04-01-2008 10:14 AM #23
      Quote, originally posted by Tornado2dr »
      A friend of mine built a nice little dirt go-kart track on his farm, it has a neat little turn that mimics LagunaSeca's corcscrew, but with more fear due to the trees.
      This is probably as close as you wanna come to your own racetrack, or if you have a really big plot of land, just make your driveway very long and twisty.

      This is what I think would be a blast. Pack down some gravel really tight and you're talking "near" pavement conditions. If a few people went together, they could write it off as CRP land and build a 1/4 scale dream track. Anybody have any pics of homebuilt go-kart tracks?


    24. 04-01-2008 11:33 AM #24
      the new track here in utah was about 60 mil for everything, he was originally just going to build it for himself, and that was going to be about 10 mil

    25. Member Tornado2dr's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 11:44 AM #25
      Quote, originally posted by High Plains Drifter »

      This is what I think would be a blast. Pack down some gravel really tight and you're talking "near" pavement conditions. If a few people went together, they could write it off as CRP land and build a 1/4 scale dream track. Anybody have any pics of homebuilt go-kart tracks?

      It really doesn't work that way. The stone won't stay compacted for long with the stresses of spinning tires and cornering, and even then it doesn't provide much grip.

      The best non-pavement tracks are really dirt-tracks (oh the horror of short ovals!), which provide the best grip when they are more clay than dirt and at a specific moisture content. Take a look at the rubber that a "dirt" track really picks up, the surface coming out of each turn is basically black at a well-prepped track.

      When we were younger and had more time for stupidity, we spent at least as much time on the tractor re-grading the kart-track at my friend's farm as we did riding on it...


    26. 04-01-2008 12:00 PM #26
      Check out the place I go to...

      http://www.autobahncountryclub.net/


    27. Member lagunaroone's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 12:03 PM #27
      Quote, originally posted by venom600 »
      Sorry, I don't have anything to add about pricing, but consider that beyond the actual land, you have to consider the fact that the sound would make it VERY difficult to build. Idiots will move next to the track and then complain that the cars are too loud, and sound carries over long distances. I live 20 miles away from California Speedway and I can hear the racing whenever I go outside during the NASCAR weekend they have.

      Ditto @ Laguna Seca


    28. 04-01-2008 12:08 PM #28
      It really depends on how much traffic, and how heavy of traffic it would see. I grew up on gravel roads and they stay pretty frim. You'd need a compactor like construction companies use, and you'd need to regravel it in the spring, maybe midsummer, and fall, but the cost would still be extremely low compared to a paved track. If you used a clay base, with the gravel topping, you should have a fairly good surface.

      Gravel roads, at least in farm country, don't usually need compacted since the traffic they see is from heavy vehicles.

      Now the grip of gravel vs dirt is different, but dirt requires even more maintenance, constant regrading and wetting when used.


    29. Member freedomgli's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 12:12 PM #29
      Quote, originally posted by jeff@dzt »
      2.5 miles of track would probably cost about 1 to 2 million per mile for an exceptional quality road surface assuming little to no clearing and minimal grading. That's just for laying the road. Now include track design, infrastructure, zoning, legalities, advertising, etc and it gets really pricey.

      I couldn't have said it better myself. I've been looking into the same thing but I'm having trouble raising the $7-10M necessary to purchase the land, lobby government officials, get zoning approval and insurance, and hire a contractor to begin construction. I figure the most basic track will cost about $5M plus the cost of land. This will be a basic track that has the most minimal safety, crowd control, amenities, etc. and assumes there will be no mistakes, lawsuits, protests, etc. Keep in mind the summer driving season in Alberta is pretty short. If you're considering this as a business venture (vs. a rich man's private playground) you'd better have an audience interested in using your venue for winter driver training academies and snowmobile racing.

    30. 04-01-2008 01:01 PM #30
      I always wanted to make a cart track on my dads property, like 30 acres of nothing but grass

      But VIR is only about 2.5 hours away from me, so go there for racing events and the such


    31. 04-01-2008 01:35 PM #31
      Quote, originally posted by jeff@dzt »

      2.5 miles of track would probably cost about 1 to 2 million per mile for an exceptional quality road surface assuming little to no clearing and minimal grading. That's just for laying the road. Now include track design, infrastructure, zoning, legalities, advertising, etc and it gets really pricey.

      professor used to say the cost for 1 mile of highway was $5 million for 1 lane. thats the all said and done price, not the sticker price.

      i can't see the construction of a race course (focusing on the concrete and paving) being more engineered than a strip of heavy highway. different: a bit. not drastic.


    32. Member fowtj's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 02:14 PM #32
      A group of us are in the process right now:

      http://www.arkansasmotorsportranch.com

      Here is what it is costing us:

      2 million for land
      +
      1 million per mile of racetrack, so 2 million for 2 mile road course
      +
      1 million for parking lot and other infrastructure elements
      +
      1 million for clubhouse facility (read, large metal building with a cantina and lockerooms)
      +
      4 million for engineers, designers, architects, safety inspections, EPA inspections, insurance, safety, and other miscellaneous contruction and expense

      grand total = 10 million and this is a really bare bones setup

      Insurance and upkeep annually will be nuts so factor that in.




      Modified by fowtj at 1:17 PM 4-1-2008


    33. Member fowtj's Avatar
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      04-01-2008 02:19 PM #33
      oh... and before anyone says anything, YES... I know the paddock is set on the outside of turn one. The artist who did the renderings obviously isnt a racer. The drawings are not the final design, just a rough idea of how to use the land we have.

    34. 07-29-2009 02:17 AM #34
      Hi everyone. Im a recreational driver with a few skip barber classes under my belt. I'm bumping this thread because I found it as I was doing research for a university business presentation. Our goal was to build a private racetrack and offer a driving experience similar to other performance driving schools, but do this using a vehicle called the Carver One for our school. (youtube for carver vehicles if you havent seen, its really crazy)

      Anyway, our track was about 2.5 miles, roadcourse, very bare boned as far as supporting facilities (not for large sanctioned events). We found a land parcel right next to las vegas motor speedway that is auctioning for 7.9 million right now.

      We also came up with some great numbers that Im here to share with you. One great resource is from a private racetrack patent document we found. There is lots of other stuff there, but if you want to read there is some interesting parts. just enter http where the X's are in this link.

      XXXX://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20090132263

      Here is a few copy and pastes from our slides. Where you see the goofy looking copy and paste from the spread sheet, many of those costs are amortized over 5 years and 30 years for the track construction.

      # Legal, Zoning ($30,000)
      # Surveying, Grading and Preparation - $325,000
      # Paving bids of $2.0 and $2.3 million - $2.6 projected
      # Raw paving materials are cheaper in Vegas, this is disregarded in our projections.

      Maintenance and track staff ($2M 1 time initial cost, $860,000 annual)

      * 24 hr. security -2 officers
      * Spotters, Flagmen, Groundskeepers
      * 1 Fully Trained Medical Staff Member
      * transport suburban, road sweeper, equipment and fire truck

      Additional Expenses

      * Sales staff/Office Staff
      * 2 full-time instructors

      # Vehicle Fleet – 10 Carvers ($380,000)
      # Vehicle Maintenance - 15% of each vehicle
      # Insurance


      spread sheet---->

      Revenue 3,179,000.00
      Cement Pouring Exp (Amort 5 years) 520,000.00
      Zoning/Surveying Exp. 355,000.00
      Vehicle Fleet 380,000.00
      Vehicle Maintenance 53,250.00
      Building Expense (Amort 4 Years) 40,000.00
      Vehicle Rental 80,000.00
      Insurance 150,000.00
      Initial Fixed Cost (Amort 8 Years) 250,000.00
      Land Expense (30 Year Amort.) 263,333.33
      Salaries 1,000,000.00
      Admin & Supplies 10,000.00
      General Maintenance 50,000.00
      Total Expense 3,151,583.33
      Net Income (Before Taxes) 27,416.67
      Taxes 9,595.83
      Net Income 17,820.83


      Just better than breaking even. When we spoke about some cost differences and where we estimated high and on safe side, we were making the case that wed get about 1/2 million + from revenue (20 minute, full day, 3 day carving classes).

      BTW, we nailed the presentation, professor said we didnt have to take the final, as of a few hours ago I am done with college, so ya, a bit of a brag post here. We really killed the presentation though, so trust me that some of these number are pretty solid. There i certainly some weaknesses such as insurance, legal stuff and more medical staff, but this should be a good good first post here IMHO.



      Modified by lumpfink at 11:28 PM 7/28/2009


    35. 07-29-2009 02:21 AM #35
      Miller Motorsports park = $100 million

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